Vitamins??

[swinters66]

I was looking though a pet solutions catalog, and saw a few supplements for fish. I looked at the Kent Zoe Vitamins, and the discus essential? Are these things necessary? I mean if I have good water parameters, and they get a good varied diet, are adding things like the Kent products overkill?

Has anyone used these products before?

Just a curiousity really.

[CARY_GLdiscus]

IMO YES!

LOSE THEM....

However if you do have very poor water quality to start and your pockets are fat! then I guess it would be ok! however I believe most of the nutrients are discus get in a closed system comes from the foods we feed! this is why a big Menu is advised! also not to mention consumption works faster then absorption IMO + others smarter then Me.

So... before You move forward think about this! If Your changing water daily or even every other! how could theses products work without adding them every time and keeping them there??

One thing that might steer you in the right direction is if You make Your own Beef heart You can go to the reptile section at your shop and pick up a bottle of multi- Victims and calcium powder for reptiles and mix it right in WORKS GREAT!.

Well hth

Cary Gld!

[GulfCoastDiscus]

Hey Cary,
Nice seeing you back. Butterflies looks great.:)

I use Centrum Liquid mixed in the beefheart.

[lhforbes12]

Yeah I just get liquid multi vitamins from the store and add to food every so often.

Cary,
Were you saying you use it as a bath?

[hexed]

Larry,
I believe Cary is saying that if you do daily water changes then adding the vitamins directly to the water is a waste of time. He adds multi- Victims and calcium powder into his beefheart mix.

Frank

[lhforbes12]

Frank,
LoL, Yep! I told you I was tired <grin>

[poconogal]

I use Kent Zoe Freshwater. It is not added to the tank water and is meant to be put in food or soak your food in. I soak my food (Tetra Bits, Freeze Dried BWs) in it for a few minutes.

Connie

[CARY_GLdiscus]

hi Connie,
why do you use freeze dried blood worms with zoe? why not ust frozzen and lose the zoe? all your doing is putting back what freeze dried takes out!


thanks Dan


hth
Cary

[swinters66]

Well thanks everyone. I really wasnt planning on buying any of those products. I like to ask Qs and research before I buy anything. I certainly don't have money to waste on products I might not ever use!! I do WCs every other day, and feed a good variety of frozen foods, and color bits occasionally.

I dont know if Ive progressed enough yet to make my own food for the discus. Maybe one day though. And maybe when I get some more fish....sounds like a lot of frozen food to make for 5 fish you know?

[used2bBubbles]

hi Connie,
why do you use freeze dried blood worms with zoe? why not ust frozzen and lose the zoe? all your doing is putting back what freeze dried takes out!


thanks Dan


hth
Cary

Cary, I'm confused (which isn't surprising!) I don't understand your comment about the zoe putting back what the freeze dried takes out. Can you explain it for me? I don't know much about foods/chemical reactions, etc.

Thanks.

[CARY_GLdiscus]

well ok,
but I thought if it made sense to me then it made sense to everyone!
LOL!

Well to put it short Connie use's zoe which is vitamins and trace elements.
What you do is soak your foods in this product to add in the good stuff.

But she also uses freeze dried bloodworms that lack theses elements. most if not all are lost durning the freeze drying stage. But again Connie makes this up by using zoe. (soaking her food in it!

So all I was saying is to stop using theses 2 products and switch to just one that is full of all the elements she needs and that's frozen bloodworms, Mysis Etc........

hth
Cary GLD!

[used2bBubbles]

Oh, now I understand. I didn't know freeze-drying removes that. Thanks for explaining it for me. :)

[CARY_GLdiscus]

No problem my friend now lets have a beer!

[April]

no beer for you cary. fone your mother...we want things from you....swordtails...and white roundish things!!! i just got some vitamins as a gift. asian ones.
home-made fish food is fun to make..and good to eat. it brings out the mad chef in everyone..a dab of this..a little of that...yummy...beefheart, krill, shrimp, spirulina, earthworms, vitamins, flake food, red pepper,salmon roe..you name it. think like a fish....grind it all up..flatten..and freeze in ziplocs. your fish will thank you.

[poconogal]

So all I was saying is to stop using theses 2 products and switch to just one that is full of all the elements she needs and that's frozen bloodworms, Mysis Etc........

hth
Cary GLD!
Hi, if I had easier access to frozen foods, I would do that. I don't live in an area where keeping fish is very popular and I don't want to pay shipping charges for frozen foods. So, when I have time to make a 1-1/2 hr. drive to the breeder, I stock up on frozen. In between, I supplement with the vitamins, and the Freeze Dried BWs make a good vehicle for the Zoe.

Connie

[CARY_GLdiscus]

thanks connie,
us fish geaks gota do what we gota do!

takecare
cary

[poconogal]

thanks connie,
us fish geaks gota do what we gota do!

takecare
cary
Yes, Cary, anything to please those buggers! I have more food for the Discus than I have for my household (or so it seems) :D
Its actually very frustrating for me sometimes when trying to find certain things for the fish. I came from NYC where anything can be had at one's fingertips, now I have to make that long drive...

Connie

[lhforbes12]

Hi, if I had easier access to frozen foods, I would do that. I don't live in an area where keeping fish is very popular and I don't want to pay shipping charges for frozen foods. So, when I have time to make a 1-1/2 hr. drive to the breeder, I stock up on frozen. In between, I supplement with the vitamins, and the Freeze Dried BWs make a good vehicle for the Zoe.

Connie


Connie,
HELLO... you work in NEW YORK CITY

[poconogal]

Connie,
HELLO... you work in NEW YORK CITY
Yes, yes I do. But for many reasons, I can't get the frozen foods and bring them home. I'll PM you.

[swinters66]

Well, considering we have 4 tanks in this house, maybe making my own fish food isn't such a bad idea. All the fish here are canrivores, so I don't think they would turn away from good frozen food.

Of course when I told my hubby, he looked at me funny. He thinks I am too overboard with my discus care....that I worry too much about them to sit back and enjoy them. That isnt really true, I do sit back and watch them and enjoy this hobby, esp. when I know the fish are healthy and swimming happily!!

So, I am going to check on the many beefheart recipes here and see if I can't come up with one that I can make relatively fast, without turning my kitchen into a disaster area!! If all goes well maybe I can try making some this coming weekend....

[lhforbes12]

Well, considering we have 4 tanks in this house, maybe making my own fish food isn't such a bad idea. All the fish here are canrivores, so I don't think they would turn away from good frozen food.

Of course when I told my hubby, he looked at me funny. He thinks I am too overboard with my discus care....that I worry too much about them to sit back and enjoy them. That isnt really true, I do sit back and watch them and enjoy this hobby, esp. when I know the fish are healthy and swimming happily!!

So, I am going to check on the many beefheart recipes here and see if I can't come up with one that I can make relatively fast, without turning my kitchen into a disaster area!! If all goes well maybe I can try making some this coming weekend....


Stephanie,
<psssst... it IS the weekend now....>

[used2bBubbles]

Well, considering we have 4 tanks in this house, maybe making my own fish food isn't such a bad idea. All the fish here are canrivores, so I don't think they would turn away from good frozen food.

Of course when I told my hubby, he looked at me funny. He thinks I am too overboard with my discus care....that I worry too much about them to sit back and enjoy them. That isnt really true, I do sit back and watch them and enjoy this hobby, esp. when I know the fish are healthy and swimming happily!!

So, I am going to check on the many beefheart recipes here and see if I can't come up with one that I can make relatively fast, without turning my kitchen into a disaster area!! If all goes well maybe I can try making some this coming weekend....

OH NO! I THINK MY HUSBAND IS MARRIED TO YOU, TOO!!! If he isn't they sure think alike!!! Mine's eyes got to be the size of saucers when I snuk in another tank...then another...finally he said, "I think you're obsessed with this." (I didn't say, "yup, I am." I protested).

Anyway, YES!!! I've made 2 batches of frozen foods for my discus and they love it. One is a chicken recipe and another is a beefheart one that was absolutely gross until I got the beefheart ground up. Try the one on this site, and I highly recommend using gelatin, which I didn't. It holds it together in the water.

Good luck!

Kathi

[hexed]

Connie,
I do not understand, if you work in NYC why not bring a small handled cooler to work with you and then get some frozen foods and put some ice in the cooler after work? That will keep them cold til you get home. As long as they are kept cold they should be fine, then put them in your freezer.

[poconogal]

Connie,
I do not understand, if you work in NYC why not bring a small handled cooler to work with you and then get some frozen foods and put some ice in the cooler after work? That will keep them cold til you get home. As long as they are kept cold they should be fine, then put them in your freezer.

The area that I work in does not have any fish stores other than Petland. Fortunoff's and fish don't seem to mix! Then I have a subway ride to the Port Authority in the sardine can train, then 2 hours home on the bus in horrid traffic, so I won't travel around Manhattan to the fish store first, because I'll be too late getting home. I get up at 4 a.m. so I go to sleep by 10 pm and I now normally get home around 7:30 - 8:00. Seriously, my time is extremely limited these days, my commute home has been getting longer and longer over the years and I barely keep up with WCs, etc. that I have to do now.

Why don't I get a job in the Poconos? (I'm sure someone is thinking that :D ) Because they want to pay $8/hr.

[swinters66]

<psssst... it IS the weekend now....>

Are you pickin' on me?? :jester:

Well, funds are depleted this weekend...seems to happen to me a lot.

Kathi....3 of the tanks are my hubbys. African and SA cichlids...he keeps heartier fish than I do, so sometimes he might think his mentality towards the care of his fish should apply to my discus. We go back and forth about this daily...we should have hidden cameras in our house...a fish keeping reality show!! :argue: <<<that would be me and the hubby!

I mean I think homemade fish food is a great idea, but he just thinks since they sell frozen fish food with everything in it that I would put in my mix, what's the point in making it? Haha it goes round and round....

[lhforbes12]

<psssst... it IS the weekend now....>

Are you pickin' on me?? :jester:

Who me? I'm innocent I tell ya, innocent!


Well, funds are depleted this weekend...seems to happen to me a lot.

Kathi....3 of the tanks are my hubbys. African and SA cichlids...he keeps heartier fish than I do, so sometimes he might think his mentality towards the care of his fish should apply to my discus. We go back and forth about this daily...we should have hidden cameras in our house...a fish keeping reality show!! :argue: <<<that would be me and the hubby!

Hmmmmmmmmm... and here I thought only me and my better half communicated over computers while sitting 3 feet from each other.


I mean I think homemade fish food is a great idea, but he just thinks since they sell frozen fish food with everything in it that I would put in my mix, what's the point in making it? Haha it goes round and round....

I agree with Hubby

[used2bBubbles]

First of all, Stephanie, IGNORE Larry. :grin:

I like giving the homemade food (sometimes, not every day) because it is cheaper than the frozen and canned stuff. The frozen stuff seems to have gone up lately.

Yea, it's work to make it, but you can throw in good stuff, like vitamins, dried food, etc. and then freeze and and TA DA! you have your own food.

Well, when the time comes, check out the post here on beefheart. I know of some people who have purchased sliced beefheart, which is much easier than the beefheart I worked with. Yuch!

[lhforbes12]

First of all, Stephanie, IGNORE Larry. :grin:

<GASP>

q~ Hmmmmmmmmmmm Hmmmmmmmmmm Hmmmm q~

[swinters66]

I don't think it's possible to ignore Mr Larry here....:p

Has anyone ever taken the plain frozen beefheart, thawed it, added more stuff to it, then re-froze it? The ingredient list says its just beefheart.

I've been using the frozen beefheart plus, which does have several other things added to it. So, I was just wondering. I looked up some of the beefheart recipes here...I didn't realize there are that many variations! So, I am still reading through them here and there.

[poconogal]

I agree with Hubby
Of course you do!

[Dave_Discus]

2 hour bus ride? Subway? I feel for you...
I whine about having to drive to a jobsite more than
a few miles away...I promise not to anymore.

That would drive me nuts:antlers:

[lhforbes12]

Of course you do!

Hmmmmmmm... and yet no hammers...

I have stopped feeding beefheart altogether, due to the fatty build up thing. It may or may not be correct, but my fish don't particularly like it anyway. I do however believe strongly in blackworms, I just wish they didn't cost so darn much.

Stephanie,
I have heard many times that it is perfectly fine to partially thaw your BH to add whatever to it and then re-freeze it. I'm not saying it's correct, just that I've heard that it's OK. Perhaps Cary or Al could comment?

[poconogal]

Hmmmmmmm... and yet no hammers...

I must be slipping. Here Larry, Larry... :smash:
Stephanie, I got him for ya!

[used2bBubbles]

You go, girl!

[swinters66]

:whip: Hammers and whips.....oh yeah! Look out Larry!!

I need to read up more on the whole garlic thing.....I'd like to add that, if it really does help their immune system like I had read....they have no problems eating now....little pigs they are! And they ALWAYS seem hungry. They act like they are starving...is that normal??

[used2bBubbles]

Stephanie, from what I've read and heard, yes, it is normal for discus to act like they're starving. That is a good thing, as Martha Stewart would say!

Unfortunately, mine must have a touch of French in them (no disrespect to the French here--just kidding). They turn their noses up at me most of the time for food. Except when it's cbw. I dunno. Maybe mine are just "low key."

Kathi

[poconogal]

Stephanie, from what I've read and heard, yes, it is normal for discus to act like they're starving. That is a good thing, as Martha Stewart would say!

Unfortunately, mine must have a touch of French in them (no disrespect to the French here--just kidding). They turn their noses up at me most of the time for food. Except when it's cbw. I dunno. Maybe mine are just "low key."

Kathi

Hey Bubbs - mine start to turn their noses up at other foods after I give them CBW more than 2x. So now I give them CBW, then wait another day and a half or two days, then give them CBW again. Regular food in between. Yours aren't low key, they are just training you! :D

[used2bBubbles]

I do that, too! In fact, I only give cbw maybe every 3rd day. I guess when they see it isn't cbw, there's no need for excitement! :(

[swinters66]

Mine mostly get the frozen beefheart plus....then Ill either give them the emerald entree or frozen bloodworms in between the BH. The only thing they really don't go after are the color bits...my larger discus will eat that if I soak some of the pellets in the bloodworm liquid. Otherwise...the harlequins eat the color bits. At least something in that tank likes them!!

[used2bBubbles]

Isn't it funny how they develop tastes? My vet says "feed the dogs the same thing. Changing dog foods can cause diahrea." Ok, then my husband says, "I'd get tired of eating the same thing all the time, let's get this this." Well, yea, I'd get real tired REAL fast if I had to eat dog food all the time, too!!!

But it can be hard feeding discus a variety just because they can be pickey. Now my angels....they'll eat just about anything as long as it's small enough! I bought cichlid sticks, thinking I could hold them for the discus (and can't) so I break them up & give them to the angels. You should have seen their reaction the first time. "So what is this??" And after about 2 nano-seconds, they were chomping away at it!

[poconogal]

Isn't it funny how they develop tastes? My vet says "feed the dogs the same thing. Changing dog foods can cause diahrea." Ok, then my husband says, "I'd get tired of eating the same thing all the time, let's get this this." Well, yea, I'd get real tired REAL fast if I had to eat dog food all the time, too!!!

But it can be hard feeding discus a variety just because they can be pickey. Now my angels....they'll eat just about anything as long as it's small enough! I bought cichlid sticks, thinking I could hold them for the discus (and can't) so I break them up & give them to the angels. You should have seen their reaction the first time. "So what is this??" And after about 2 nano-seconds, they were chomping away at it!

My angel tries to eat the freckle off my wrist!

[used2bBubbles]

My angel tries to eat the freckle off my wrist!

Now THAT'S when I call being a pig! :D