What Size Discus into Planted Tank

[joeyNdana]

First post after reading through numerous posts gaining knowledge from the experienced folks on this forum. My wife and I are ready to make the commitment to caring for discus. We have a 125 gallon on the way however we may be better off transitioning our current 75 gallon and caring for a small group in there for two reasons, smaller tank/group may be better to gain the experience and the 75 sits in a lower traffic area of the house.

While we may go the route of raising juveniles in a bb tank before introducing them to their permanent home, we are more concerned about the feeding schedule than the daily water changes due to work. So we may go the route of buying more mature discus.

Either way, my question is, at what size would you recommend adding discus to a planted tank and what would be the feeding and water change schedule at that size?

Also, back to the 75 vs. 125 debate, am I over thinking it? The 125 will be in the dining room that does have a lot of traffic getting to the kitchen, the 75 is in the living room which doesn't necessarily have "light" traffic anyway. What would you recommend and is there really much difference in the maintenance schedule between the two sizes?

Thanks for sharing your opinions, sorry for the long post.

[Keith Perkins]

I'm not a planted guy, so just a couple general answers here. Mature adults are easier to care for no matter what kind of tank you put discus in. Less feedings and less necessary WCs.

As for the 75 or 125, where are you going to enjoy them more? Perhaps you could heavily plant the high traffic end of the tank if the 125 is your answer.

[strawberryblonde]

Plenty of people hate the look of a bare bottom tank, but I think it's just because it's not what they're used to. It's actually quite beautiful! Discus grow VERY quickly. So if you purchase 3.5"- 4" sub-adults they're only going to be small for a few months and then they'll be ready for a tank with some driftwood, sand and a couple of easy going plants. Personally, I wouldn't heavily plant it till they are at least 18 months old because they are going to keep growing during that second year of life and too many plants is going to make it hard to feed heavily and continue the water changes.

I'm going to add a fair warning too, ok? =)

I put my discus into their main tank as soon as they all were between five and six inches long. Little did I know that well fed discus who get daily water changes probably aren't nearly done growing at 6"! Sooooo, plan accordingly. If it were me, I'd use the 75 to grow them out a bit, then use the 125 as a permanent home for them.

As far as foot traffic goes, so long as you raise them with plenty of movement, lights and sounds near the tank they won't have a problem living in a busy area of the house. Mine actually watch me vacuum, watch tv and follow the dog and cats from one side of the tank to the other when they walk by. They LOVE people and don't hide or spook easily. (I've never tried loud music, but then I'D go hide if anyone turned the music up in my house...lol)

Ohhhhhhh, forgot to add that you can add a couple nice pieces of driftwood to your 75 while your discus are growing out. It's easy to remove it during cleanings, give a good rinse and then plop it back in and it can add a very realistic touch to the tank since discus don't live in water full of plants in the wild, they live in water full of driftwood. =)

[rcomeau]

My tank was once planted with Discus and I am now few months into using it a bare bottom tank for discus. Based on the limits of that experience and what I have read on SD...

In addition ensuring that the tank is cycled (filter with bacteria to remove amonia, nitrite, and most nitrate), Discus want the PH to be consistent, low nitrates, and 84 deg F. My tap water has been about PH=6.5 with chloramine in it and nitrates can be detected at about 5 ppm before addressing it. The tap water has carbonic acid in it that makes the PH lower. It takes about 3 hours of aeration and heating to 'age' it to 84 deg PH=7 to match the tank water. Aeration degasses the carbonic acid as carbon dioxide to raise the PH from 6.5 to 7. I use Prime to detoxify the chloramine. I change 50% of the tank water every other day to keep the nitrates low. The bare bottom makes it easy to remove most of the waste that might contribute to higher nitrate levels.

Now lets compare that to what plants want...

Plants want adequate lighting, fertilization, CO2 in the water, and some are ok with 84 deg F. I suppose that discus can get used to the lights. My discus mostly hide from the lights unless they see me approaching with food. I don't know how discus cope with fertilization except that my discus definately didn't like my attempt to kill algae with off-label over doses of Flourish Excel. Maintaining the CO2 levels that plants want gets tricky. If you put a PH probe in a planted tank that has healthy plants in it, with water that has CO2 in it, then turn on the lights that are appropriate to make plants grow, you will see the PH rise as the plants consume the CO2 literally within minutes. That is where CO2 injection is used to put the CO2 back in the water to keep the PH at the same level while the plants consume the CO2. It is also important to keep enough buffer in the water to maintain stable PH level.

If/when discus get to be less than healthy in a planted tank, the advise given in the forum tends to suggest that you should have avoided putting discus in the planted tank at best or to change to a bare bottom tank at least. I haven't seen much constructive discussion about making discus and plants work together.

There are videos on youtube from a guy that describes how he is able to keep discus in a planted tank. That same guy also points out that he keeps all of his juvies in bare bottoms.

[MKD]

+1
Very nice Toni.

Beside easy to maintain BB tank, I want to add another good reasons to raise discus in 75g BB tank, it is easier to diagnose when come to treatment and easy to notify/identify weird behavior Also great opportunity to work/balance the planted tank because you dont want to move young discus in/out to balabce or treat plants.

Rcomeau beat me.
Agree with rcomeau

[joeyNdana]

I appreciate the opinions and advice. I'm really glad I threw these questions out there because the responses reminded me of the reasons why I decided to make the commitment to caring for Discus in the first place and a planted tank really wasn't part of the inspiration. My interest in plants just coincided with wanting to grow in this hobby, that is why I wanted a second large tank.

There were two things that inspired me to finally make the jump. 1st, I bought a Python cleaner, I had no idea water changes could be so easy, a big concern for raising Discus solved, I can meet the water change schedule with ease.

2nd, when I saw Jeff Senske's Discus hardscape, the simplistic, yet artstic view of this tank really allows the beauty of the discus to shine and, no plants. I love the hardscaping aspect of aquarium decorating, even in my planted tank the plants will be meant to compliment the hardscape. I guess my thoughts were long term I'd want some green in the scape, but that may not be the case after all.


http://www.aquariumdesigngroup.com/sources/ipad/#portfolios/8/0/0.

Heck, I'm even experimenting with a 10 gallon hardscape only tank right now.

So I guess my follow up question is, if I introduce 4-5" discus in a tank with a thin layer of fine white gravel, a few pieces of driftwood and rocks, what would you recommend as a water change and feeding schedule?

[lipadj46]

So I guess my follow up question is, if I introduce 4-5" discus in a tank with a thin layer of fine white gravel, a few pieces of driftwood and rocks, what would you recommend as a water change and feeding schedule?

With 5" fish If you plan on using a good pellet and feed in the morning and evening with no food leftover you could probably get away with weekly 95% water changes with a good vacuuming mid week and replacing the water removed. I would use a thin layer of pool filter sand as it is easier to keep clean as the detritus stays on the surface. I've never actually done this so take it for whats it's worth. I'm always growing out with daily water changes. I hope to one day to be happy with my adults then add some sand and anubias and java ferns on my driftwood and take it easy with the water changes, we will see.

[Keith Perkins]

Thin layer of gravel didn't sound too good to me either.

[Tazalanche]

First off, welcome to Simply! :wave:

Our lightly planted 135 currently has 14 4.5"-6+" discus in it with pool filter sand, plants in the middle & large driftwood at each end with eheim 2217 & 2236 canister filters. The pool filter sand is only thick enough to cover the bottom across the tank, except where the plants are located & it's maybe up to 2" there. It is in the living room, next to the kitchen & a very high traffic area.

They're fed at 6am & 5pm, with a vacuuming of the tank & water change minimum of 20 gallons every evening. Depending on our schedule, they get a 40-80 gallon water change on Saturday or Sunday.

When the smaller ones were still growing out, they were in a 55 bare bottom (plus driftwood) with a minimum water change of 25 gallons per evening.

While our routines are not as much as most on here, they are the most we are comfortable with due to high nitrates in our tap water. Once we get our house built I'll be getting some decent water filtration for the fish room so that I am more comfortable with larger water changes.

I hope that helps. Good luck.

[Elliots]

To make your water changes even easier try two Pythons! As far as fish for a planted tank I bought 5" fish from Hans. I did not want to start with anything smaller than 4". For my money the 5" were a better buy than the 4" and much cheaper than the 6". I did not consider 3"